How 'tight' is tight enough.

[MrsPill]

An interesting point came up yesterday when I told a friend my food intake yesterday:
B: Slimfast cafe latte and milky coffee(on the run!)-328cals
L:2 Finn crispbreads and some philly light and 1/2 tub low fat cottage cheese and pineapple and a Shape yoghurt-268cals
D:6 well cooked streaky rashers bacon, 2 dry fried eggs, snap tin beans, 2 tomatoes, 2 small slices Hovis bread-646
s: cup of tea and a breadstick

Total calorie intake:1250-ish.
My evening meal came about because I fancied something really salty and although it was heavy on calories I felt I needed something substantial after a totally shitty day at work! Ok- psychological reasons for eating maybe(end of week celebration!) but I counted everything in so that I didn't binge etc.

My point here is that I can still eat all this volume and other bandits can't eat that much but more importantly, everyones provider has different expectations about the volume that they expect their patients to be able to eat. I've long suspected that my band is NOWHERE near as tight as anyone elses. I've had about 5 fills in 8 months and I've got 6.5ml in an 11ml band which has been frustratingly slow to get to and which is totally meaningless because we're all different sizes and we all have different types of band.( see other post!)
I also have very little say in whether I get a fill or not. I've had to fight tooth and nail to get anywhere near enough restriction and my provider says thats because in their experience it avoids getting it too tight and needing an emergency defill or worse still, ignoring it and getting erosions etc etc. So they take it incredibly slowly but surely, and give massive support in between in terms of as many dietician appts as you want or talk to the nurse or see her for support as you start gradually to change your head and attitude towards food.
I have to say that its been excrutiatingly slow! I notice bandits who have other providers get filled quickly and very tightly which gives much more restriction than me on a faster timescale and have consequently lost far greater weights but I've never needed a defill...ever!I spose I don't have enough in!!! Having said that. I'm now at a point where I don't really feel as hungry any more. A slimfast holds me till lunchtime whereas before I'd have been gnawing my arm off by 11am! A couple of crackers with some protein at 1pm keeps me until 6.30pm when I get my tea so I'm doing something right... and they actually think I'm at my sweet spot. But I have to say that I can eat almost anything, I have PB'd occasionally and if I took my time and grazed at a buffet( as I have done) I could get a 2nd plate but it took me 3 times as long to eat it as everyone else!!

Its has led me to a very interesting conclusion: All healthcare providers are different and that gastric bands are still in their infancy and they are all still learning about the best policy.

Anyone got any thoughts?

Sorry for going on! Had to share xx

 

[flutterby1966]

Mrs P - you are so right I think

I eat a lot more than other peoples food diaries I see, and compare, even though I know we are all different. And I can still eat volume (if its the wrong type of food or if my band loosens just before TOTM). I hang my head in shame at my 2000+ calories yesterday. But not for long LOL because with the self-control that my band has given me together with the amount of restriction I have (10mls in 14ml band), I feel the restriction I have is right for me. Its all about moderation / balance for me. My overall average calories for this week was 1270 per day - which for me, I feel comfortable with. I have enjoyed what I have wanted to eat, but just less of it than I would have done pre-band. We are in this for the long haul, so whichever path we choose, it has to be sustainable long term! 3lbs off for me this week, so I cannot be going far wrong

 

[Fuffs]

I am pre op for a bypass, but was fascinated by your thread.

What you are was very healthy and protein lead. And I am guessing a lot less that you ate pre band???

Would you like to eat less? X

 

[MrsPill]

Well, thats a really good question Fuffs.
And I probably would answer it differently on different days! Because when you are an emotional eater AND a volume eater it is difficult to control both with a band. But I want to combat my food demons myself. I want the control back. I want to be able to say that it was MY choice eventually.... and I think I currently have enough in to control my hunger most of the time but I do have a self sabotage button sometimes where I will push the limits of my band. I guess I shall try to limit any sabotage my emotions cause and strive to change my coping mechanisms! Although I enjoy food and I find it also very exciting!!!.
Unravel that if you can!

 

[JO28172]

I think as you know I'm curious on this one to see others opinions. take for example last week, I sat down with a Chinese from morrisons, one dish with a spring roll, at the halfway point that was it...just couldn't put anymore in! It was frustrating as tasted bloody good....but I knew one more fork full and I'd have brought it back up. so I could only sit and 'long' for the rest of it! same with my hotel breakfast yesterday of 1 bacon, 1 egg and a few beans. It was only your breakfast come tea that got me thinking and not from a calorie perspective but from a volume angle. you then start to think what's right? Being able to eat more but rely a little more on us to stop, or for our band to firmly stop us and say stop now! interesting thinking...and I guess we won't get an answer as its whatever suits us individually........(but..still thinking)..lol x

 

[Fuffs]

I find this interesting I started a thread on the psychological aspects after WLS earlier this week. I asked basically though you physically can't eat more does your mind want more? Are you physically and mentally satisfied by a small meal?

I am now seeing from the answers on here and there, that maybe the type of surgery can change the answer. And additionally to that, what your personal relationship with food was pre surgery.

Fascinating

My bypass is next Friday. I have reduced portions a while back. But know I CAN eat more if I to. After my bypass that won't be the case. So was wondering if some people resent their pouch when enjoying food

Thanks ladies and sorry for going off on one lol

 

[JO28172]

No fuffs I'm with you! Last week i so resented my band for not letting me eat that Chinese as was gorgeous...but then I was only mad for that minute and then went on to pat my port area and thank it for doing its job! Lol so I do see how some people could resent it. It's just with the band we control restriction re fills to a certain degree, none of us are experts, so it's a valid question raised in the thread title. Good luck for next week xx

 

[Fuffs]

No fuffs I'm with you! Last week i so resented my band for not letting me eat that Chinese as was gorgeous...but then I was only mad for that minute and then went on to pat my port area and thank it for doing its job! Lol so I do see how some people could resent it. It's just with the band we control restriction re fills to a certain degree, none of us are experts, so it's a valid question raised in the thread title. Good luck for next week xx

Thank you for that its great learning of the psychology for people behind different WLS options. And thank you very much I am dead excited xxx

 

[BlueDiamond]

Hiya Gals and Guys

Very interesting thread

I noticed from your thread Mrs P that you tend to eat more in the evenings , this could be as some banders experience that their bands are tighter in the mornings and loosens as the day goes on perhaps. ( Just thinking out loud here tbh) and yes all providers do things differently that's why I think its always important not to compare with other people because it can be disheartening when some people are getting fills /restriction quicker and you feel like you have been left behind etc. As for you being able to eat anything, I can eat almost anything too ( apart from the usual suspects eggs, rice, bread,etc) so your not alone on that score.

I understand where you are coming from with regards to the amount your eating "visually" when I started out on my journey I used to think gawd it looks like I am eating a lot or should I be able to eat this amount etc, but I think for me personally that was more of a case of eyes bigger then me belly syndrome, I wasn't listening to me body , more of a case of what my eyes could see ( hope that makes sense Mrs P) Listen to what your band is telling you dont go on what you can see on your plate, I understand your providers on the err of caution with fills, as frustrating as it is. Do they do your fills under x ray ?? some people have larger fills done under x ray to ascertain whether the fills is enough/too much judging by the flow of the water they get you to drink straight afterwards, even if u said it was ok and not tight they would know if it was flowing to slow/quick etc. Wishing you all the best Mrs P - Much luv to everyone x ( gawd didnt I ramble on too , lol )

 

[Fuffs]

It was a great post Bluediamond so worth the ramble lol

 

[tranquil_butterfly]

I have this dilemma and am due to see my provider next Friday and see whether to have a fill or not. My loss has been excruciatingly slow - but I have found it has come off and stayed off. My head may want to tell me to binge but there is no way I can do it with the restriction I have unless I want to spend the day getting up close and personal with my toilet.

I am experiencing terrible sickness bouts at the moment and I do not know if I am too tight because I have too much in my band or because I am stressed as hell which I am and that is causing it. I find it impossible to eat anything much before 12.30. I tried to start having breakfast of weetabix with lots of milk (skimmed) and it was so uncomfortable I had to stop that after a couple of days. I am better in the evenings but how much I manage and whether it stays down depends on how I am feeling. I know it is not right and my consultant did say he would arrange another xray to check things out which is what I am going to ask he does. I can honestly say I never experience hunger pangs. I tend to fancy something then find when I try it that it does not stay down. I miss eating chicken so much but it does not matter what form it comes in it just will not go down and stay down. Same with eggs and I am now struggling with tuna. I would love to have three meals a day but the best I can manage is two with varying success in terms of keeping it in my system.

Sorry I am rambling but I understand where you are coming from Mrs P.

tranquil x

 

[MrsPill]

Fuffs- my answer to your question on my relationship with food pre-surgery would take 3hrs! Its now a changing relationship for which I'm eternally grateful. I know how it happened and I knew how to change it but I just couldn't do it.

Nobody here is rambling more than me!

One of the issues that was discussed with me right from the start was I had to get my head away from "how much can I get through my band at this meal or today" and start really thinking about "how much protein can I get through and how can I limit my carbs and fats" because we can live without carbs and fats to a certain extent but we cannot survive without protein. So eating should become a nutrition issue rather than a emotional or volume issue.
Its complicated by other stuff like socialising and working and ......life in general!
It is very personal. I like that I can control it myself- I like that I can go out for meals and control what I eat- I like that I don't get that gnawing grumbling stomach hunger any more because that drive to eat is mind-blowingly powerful.
Just a shame there isn't a band for alcohol! (only joking!....alcohol isn't issue for me-I control it and not the other way around!)

I appreciate everyones replies....this thing has consumed my every waking hour since last 14th July 2011 and before that too....I just want it to work because I was one of the most miserable, unhappy breathless unfit people in the world before and I hated myself!

( And TB- I think you're a bit tight!! imho! but thats just me xx)

 

[miserable]

Mrs Pill, big big hugs xxx don't want to say anymore

 

[Fuffs]

Thank you for that amazing answer Mrs P. You are awesome xxx

 

[BlueDiamond]

@ TB I agree with Mrs P sounds like ur a little tight. xx

 

[MrsPill]

Thank you for that amazing answer Mrs P. You are awesome xxx

Haha- thankyou- Its on my mind a lot! Actually I'm not sure Mr P would agree that I'm awesome- he's started to glaze over when I start on about my band/eating!!

 

[MrsPill]

I find this interesting I started a thread on the psychological aspects after WLS earlier this week. I asked basically though you physically can't eat more does your mind want more? Are you physically and mentally satisfied by a small meal?
I still suffer from eyes bigger than belly syndrome and I amaze myself that I can be satisfied with so little after having my band filled appropriately. I think, for me, if I can't eat any more and food starts 'backing up' I feel full and then I don't feel hungry any more so the drive to eat disappears . If you still need to eat after that you have to analyse why you want to eat if you're not satisfied by your meal post-surgery. eg last Sunday I wasn't that hungry but my son was fed up and miserable and wanted a pizza and I was tired and couldn't be bothered to cook so we had Pizza Hut. Well, for him thats not a big issue because he's slim and he controls his food although he was comfort eating and I was a willing participant to help him feel better- see, I still find it difficult to find strength sometimes!!

I am now seeing from the answers on here and there, that maybe the type of surgery can change the answer. And additionally to that, what your personal relationship with food was pre surgery.

Fascinating

My bypass is next Friday. I have reduced portions a while back. But know I CAN eat more if I to. After my bypass that won't be the case. So was wondering if some people resent their pouch when enjoying food

Thanks ladies and sorry for going off on one lol

I really wish you well for your surgery xx

 

[Sophie 124]

Ooooooh god, I'm scared now... I'm going for another fill today because my restriction seems to have slacked off a bit since coming back from holiday a couple of weeks ago.... But even now, there is NO WAY I couldve eaten your dinner Mrs Pill or a slice of pizza.
I see some posts where people have 0.25 of a fill and it makes a huge difference. I always worry about it being too tight because I don't want to be in a situation where I can't eat anything, but at the same time I'm always told by my provider to stay on top of my fills!
I guess it's difficult to know 'how tight is tight enough' when you haven't really got anything to compare it to. Xx

 

[Mazza]

Hi Mrs P

Well it sounds to me that you are an evening eater, how do I know this because I was one too! Did you eat that much because you could or where you really hungry?

I spoke to my provider early on post band about this becuase what I was doing was serving myself too much, then when I couldnt eat it all going back to it.

I was given the following tips, well similar to these anyway:

Are You An Evening Eater? Try this exercise to find out.
Use a nutrition tracker (such as myfitnesspal) to track 3-5 typical days of eating. Review each day's results and use your records to answer the following questions:

1. How many meals and snacks did you eat after 5:00 pm?
2. How many meals and snacks did you eat during the day?
3. How many total calories did you consume after 5:00 pm?
4. How many total calories did you consume for the day?
5. What activities occurred while you ate after 5:00 pm?

You may have a problem with evening eating if:

• More than one-third of your meals & snacks are eaten after 5:00 pm.
• More than one-third of your total calories are consumed after 5:00 pm
• Evening eating constantly occurs with another activity.
  
  Put An End to the Cycle!
  You CAN control evening eating. Try these tips to normalize sleeping patterns and fend off hunger:
  • Plan activities to do throughout the evening, but don't make food a part of the activity:
    • Take a bath
    • Walk the dog
    • Pay bills; balance the books
    • Play board games
    • Call a friend
    • Keep your hands busy (polish the silver, sew, knit, or do any craft)
    • Read a book or magazine
    • Try a relaxing fitness video such as yoga or tai chi.
  • Eat 3 meals daily and 1-2 planned snacks, keeping in mind your total calorie range.
  • Plan to eat about the same number of calories at each meal throughout the day. The total should be within your calorie range.
  • Have a low-calorie beverage in the evening.
  • Make a list of low-calorie snack options. Select one for the evening. Eat it, but no more.
  • Don't eat mindlessly! Eat all meals and snacks at the kitchen table, keeping all of your attention on the food you're enjoying. Take your time and really enjoy every bite.
  • Get 7-8 hours of sleep nightly.
  • Maintain a regular bed and wake time schedule, even on the weekend.
  • Establish a regular, relaxing bedtime routine.
  • If you have trouble sleeping, leave the bed (or room) and pursue another activity like reading until you're ready to sleep. Use your bedroom only for sleep and sex.
  • Finish eating at least two to three hours before your regular bedtime.
  • Exercise regularly.
  • Avoid caffeine and alcohol close to bedtime; avoid nicotine altogether.

Head issues are a nightmare to deal with and we can spend many an hour worrying about things.


I dont really know if you need another fill, it sounds like you dont because you can control / manage on a small amount for breakfast and lunch.


There you go, I have waffled far more than the rest of you - ha ha :553: xx

 

[Daisyhappy!]

That's a great post Maz!
Im very much an evening eater, well i certainly was until this fill. After that I've stuck religiously to three meals a day and sometimes a low cal sugar free jelly after my dinner. I've had my most successful week and not felt once like i was dieting. I know i could eat a lot more in the evenings but at no time am i hungry. Eating was like an evening hobby of mine, Im too busy in work during the day to think about food so i always used to think, if i worked 24hour days i would be skinny
I take so much time now preparing my meal and eating it that i don't seem to notice the rest of the evening go in.x