j.u.s.t.l.i.z.
Runs Srh Support Group
oh ***** look wots happened every 1's kickkin off x 2 be expected eh 
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Why do people try and jeopardise their operations?
- Thread starter jaffa_cake
- Start date
j.u.s.t.l.i.z.
Runs Srh Support Group
im on round 3 surgery X3 funding am i undeserving ? oh **** it, its way to complicated na nite girls n boys x I LOVE U ALL OK X
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dottychic
New Member
I totally agree Caz, Im waiting for my op, on the NHS and Im going into this with my eyes wide open. I dont expect to come home from the hospital perfect when I didnt go in that way. I speak to people who are over 12 months out and they are still learning, doesnt make them bad. I think someone who posts on here that they have had a bad day are after support, they want help not judgement and I hope when its my turn to ask for help I will get help and not another guilt trip..........Ive had enough of them to last me 2 lifetimes. x
x
j.u.s.t.l.i.z.
Runs Srh Support Group
Grace
New Member
Just thought I'd add my two-pennorth!
I'm absolutely thrilled that I'm getting NHS funding. I don't think I could find a way to fund the surgery otherwise. Because having worked for most of my adult life as a nurse, midwife, social worker and probation officer (not that that's necessarily relevant, except that basically what I'm saying is that since age 17 I've been caring for other people in tough, poorly paid jobs)....but since 2002 I've been unable to work because of ill-health and had to survive on benefits..............
Which is demeaning, degrading and completely takes away any kind of independence or dignity (in my opinion, and not because it should, but because of how it's so appallingly handled by the government and others who hate so-called' scroungers)
so for some private funding, even by borrowing, re-mortgaging etc just ISN'T an option. BUT for others it is. However I completely agree that the post-code lottery is totally unfair. I personally HATE it. It's completely unjust. The system sucks. Period.
What does tat have to do with how people behave post-op? ABSOLUTELY nothing. Sorry Jaffa Cake, but I hate your reasoning. I hate completely the idea of the 'deserving' vs 'the underserving', which is basically what you appear to be suggesting.
Let's face it. NO-ONE got into this state of obesity without something triggering a very unhealthy attitude to food. It's an illness. WE wouldn't be arguing like this about anorexia treatment. Or would we?
So...an illness needs treatment. personally, I think the NHS is making some very short-sighted and unwise decisions. Because they could invest in a programme of psychological intervention pre-op that would pay BIG dividends post-op for many. But as usual they go for the cheapest option, (well SRH seems to) with little or no psychological help pre-op.
So people have the surgery with many of their bad habits and poor coping strategies still very much intact...and the find post-op, like someone very wisely said previously, that they didn't get a lobotomy!
So they struggle (predictably) to change...and turn to a site like this (Thank God it exists!) for peer support help, which is CLINICALLY PROVEN (by the way!) to enhance people's success rate. And I imagine that most eventually get sorted, whilst a few (like poor George Best) fail. Because their problems were so enormous in the first place, that they needed much more help and intervention before surgery was ever done.
What they DON'T need is judgemental attitudes, cruelty, criticism and basically, more pain. They're screaming out for help. They've had enough of the other stuff. They've probably had that from many, many other sources for all of the time their weight has been a problem.
Isn't that why WLS exists?
And YES, sometimes a kick up the bum will be needed, but it needs to be done with love, care and compassion.
As an ex-probation officer especially, I'm a believer in second chances. And third,fourth, fifth, etc etc. I NEVER want anyone to write me of. And I hope I will never write someone else off.
Here endeth the rant!
I'm absolutely thrilled that I'm getting NHS funding. I don't think I could find a way to fund the surgery otherwise. Because having worked for most of my adult life as a nurse, midwife, social worker and probation officer (not that that's necessarily relevant, except that basically what I'm saying is that since age 17 I've been caring for other people in tough, poorly paid jobs)....but since 2002 I've been unable to work because of ill-health and had to survive on benefits..............
Which is demeaning, degrading and completely takes away any kind of independence or dignity (in my opinion, and not because it should, but because of how it's so appallingly handled by the government and others who hate so-called' scroungers)
so for some private funding, even by borrowing, re-mortgaging etc just ISN'T an option. BUT for others it is. However I completely agree that the post-code lottery is totally unfair. I personally HATE it. It's completely unjust. The system sucks. Period.
What does tat have to do with how people behave post-op? ABSOLUTELY nothing. Sorry Jaffa Cake, but I hate your reasoning. I hate completely the idea of the 'deserving' vs 'the underserving', which is basically what you appear to be suggesting.
Let's face it. NO-ONE got into this state of obesity without something triggering a very unhealthy attitude to food. It's an illness. WE wouldn't be arguing like this about anorexia treatment. Or would we?
So...an illness needs treatment. personally, I think the NHS is making some very short-sighted and unwise decisions. Because they could invest in a programme of psychological intervention pre-op that would pay BIG dividends post-op for many. But as usual they go for the cheapest option, (well SRH seems to) with little or no psychological help pre-op.
So people have the surgery with many of their bad habits and poor coping strategies still very much intact...and the find post-op, like someone very wisely said previously, that they didn't get a lobotomy!
So they struggle (predictably) to change...and turn to a site like this (Thank God it exists!) for peer support help, which is CLINICALLY PROVEN (by the way!) to enhance people's success rate. And I imagine that most eventually get sorted, whilst a few (like poor George Best) fail. Because their problems were so enormous in the first place, that they needed much more help and intervention before surgery was ever done.
What they DON'T need is judgemental attitudes, cruelty, criticism and basically, more pain. They're screaming out for help. They've had enough of the other stuff. They've probably had that from many, many other sources for all of the time their weight has been a problem.
Isn't that why WLS exists?
And YES, sometimes a kick up the bum will be needed, but it needs to be done with love, care and compassion.
As an ex-probation officer especially, I'm a believer in second chances. And third,fourth, fifth, etc etc. I NEVER want anyone to write me of. And I hope I will never write someone else off.
Here endeth the rant!
shelbell
Proudly maintaining
Adding in my tuppence worth. Which is just my opinion.
Moderation to me is different to repeatedly bending and breaking the post op rules. Moderation is normal, and acceptable, and should eventually become a way of life for people. On the flipside, there are members here who frequently break the rules and eat stuff they really shouldn't, and even some who seem to revel in it and gloat about it.
On one side, there is the carb and trash trap, where in the first 4 months you can 'get away' with breaking some food rules and still lose weight. By nature, most people will easily fall into this, and it depends then on your will power and how knowledgable you are as to the eating required post op, the reasoning behind it, and the pitfalls to avoid. What we see happening is post-oppers in this trap reaching 4-6 months and hitting long stalls, and negligable losses. Not always, there are a few who struggle at this stage regardless of what they eat, but they are few and far between.
Secondly, the journey to surgery makes a huge difference, and this is where many private patients come unstuck. It is my opinion, that unless there is a medical urgency for the surgery, then it should be a long journey to get it. All patients should have to go through a decent lifestyle and weight management course, and a proper and thorough psychological assessment as to suitability for surgery prior to funding being granted. It took me nearly 2 years to get funding and it did me the world of good, as in that time I was re-educated, dealt with the majority of my food demons, and received psychological support for dealing with the surgery, which I can still access now should I need it. I get extremely frustrated when I see posts saying 'I've got to do 6 months weight management, how can I bypass this?'! I thought I knew everything about nutrition, balanced meals etc, but I learned a lot and benefited hugely from my 12 months of it. I have seen more private patients than NHS patients come unstuck due to psychological problems and lack of coping mechanisms, due to the rapid route to surgery and the lack of emotional and psychological support.
In an ideal world, there would be a standardised criteria, a standardised referral pathway, and a standardised level of post operative care for all. However, that is a long way off and at times seems like a pipe dream, so for now many patients can only rely on sites like this for their support, education and guidance, which is why the non-judgemental element of this forum is so crucial.
Moderation to me is different to repeatedly bending and breaking the post op rules. Moderation is normal, and acceptable, and should eventually become a way of life for people. On the flipside, there are members here who frequently break the rules and eat stuff they really shouldn't, and even some who seem to revel in it and gloat about it.
On one side, there is the carb and trash trap, where in the first 4 months you can 'get away' with breaking some food rules and still lose weight. By nature, most people will easily fall into this, and it depends then on your will power and how knowledgable you are as to the eating required post op, the reasoning behind it, and the pitfalls to avoid. What we see happening is post-oppers in this trap reaching 4-6 months and hitting long stalls, and negligable losses. Not always, there are a few who struggle at this stage regardless of what they eat, but they are few and far between.
Secondly, the journey to surgery makes a huge difference, and this is where many private patients come unstuck. It is my opinion, that unless there is a medical urgency for the surgery, then it should be a long journey to get it. All patients should have to go through a decent lifestyle and weight management course, and a proper and thorough psychological assessment as to suitability for surgery prior to funding being granted. It took me nearly 2 years to get funding and it did me the world of good, as in that time I was re-educated, dealt with the majority of my food demons, and received psychological support for dealing with the surgery, which I can still access now should I need it. I get extremely frustrated when I see posts saying 'I've got to do 6 months weight management, how can I bypass this?'! I thought I knew everything about nutrition, balanced meals etc, but I learned a lot and benefited hugely from my 12 months of it. I have seen more private patients than NHS patients come unstuck due to psychological problems and lack of coping mechanisms, due to the rapid route to surgery and the lack of emotional and psychological support.
In an ideal world, there would be a standardised criteria, a standardised referral pathway, and a standardised level of post operative care for all. However, that is a long way off and at times seems like a pipe dream, so for now many patients can only rely on sites like this for their support, education and guidance, which is why the non-judgemental element of this forum is so crucial.
phatmomma
New Member
Very well said Charis......... What a hornet's nest has been opened up! I have enjoyed reading everyone's response and although heated am very proud of you all as i thought this might turn into a 'nasty' one but it hasn't. Well done you losers n wannabe losers...
And yes the postcode lottery is ridiculous, my biggest beef with my provider is this... My pct sends me and lots of other people to Walsall Manor (which is another pct to mine) for surgery and they make a fortune from it, but then the people who actually live within Walsall pct's boundaries have to fight tooth n nail for surgery and jump through lots of hoops before they 'might' get approval for surgery! Now that is very wrong i think...
And yes the postcode lottery is ridiculous, my biggest beef with my provider is this... My pct sends me and lots of other people to Walsall Manor (which is another pct to mine) for surgery and they make a fortune from it, but then the people who actually live within Walsall pct's boundaries have to fight tooth n nail for surgery and jump through lots of hoops before they 'might' get approval for surgery! Now that is very wrong i think...
phatmomma
New Member
Shel i agree with you. Last week i attened my husbands psychiatric assessment with him and actually said to the psychiatrist that i wish i'd been offered this facility pre op!
I think we wait long enough for the surgery for us to be able to attend weight/management whilst we wait and this could be beneficial. I know i spoke to someone who had been banded (3 days post op they were), they had no idea why they were in pain (wind) or what they could eat and within 5 minutes of chat she was asking me she was going on a girls night out and would she be okay drinking in 6 weeks time...... She had no idea about food choices or anything, not only had she got no idea about nutrition she had done no research, even though i gave her the address for this site! Now that i found really annoying!!!
I think we wait long enough for the surgery for us to be able to attend weight/management whilst we wait and this could be beneficial. I know i spoke to someone who had been banded (3 days post op they were), they had no idea why they were in pain (wind) or what they could eat and within 5 minutes of chat she was asking me she was going on a girls night out and would she be okay drinking in 6 weeks time...... She had no idea about food choices or anything, not only had she got no idea about nutrition she had done no research, even though i gave her the address for this site! Now that i found really annoying!!!
Just read through some of the responses on this thread and I'd like to add a few points. Hope I don't bore you all! Forgive me if I do! xxx
My background has been in the community mental health field for more years than I can count... I won't labour my experience... but after many years working in and out of psychiatric hospitals and the transfer of 'care in the community' post Virginia Bottomley... I have gained a lot of insight into the anguish of many and as such I am responding to this post.
It is a very 'closed' view to try and place individuals in their 'rightful boxes in society'... these boxes cannot and should not exist for the fundamental reason that we are individuals from every angle and we are not programmed like machinery to fit in like a 'cog in a wheel'.
Each individual's case history and story on their journey is unique to them and everyone's situation varies via physical, mental, or financial circumstances.
I cannot therefore see why anyone should be 'labelled or made to feel inadequate in any way'... this journey is hard enough for everyone involved and if someone 'chose' to opt for a private alternative... then that is what is right for them...
I have considered the private option... but have now discontinued that thought... it was part of my journey to explore it... but I am intent on learning, digesting and working through my issues in a 'balanced' way before my surgery.
It is my 'choice' to wait and to have the operation on the NHS, although it has been offered to me through the efforts of my diabetic consultant... I do not see myself as a burden to the NHS because I have worked all of my life, nor do I think anyone who has not been able to work should be made to feel guilty either...
The majority of us have 'comfort' ate, or call it what you like for reasons which are individual and I would like to say that no matter what... I would always hope to learn and share my experience to encourage others to start this difficult journey...
I do not believe in stigmatising individuals, who may already be feeling sensitive or lost and in fear of their future... that is not the way to go...
We have choices, about whether we throw open the hand of friendship and support... many of us don't have choices about whether we pay or don't pay...
Whichever way we all need support and all need consideration as individuals... what I would not want to see is any of my friends on here hurt or feeling put down in any way.
I would like to say that I am hoping to be around on this site for a long time in order to not only get myself through my journey, but to show care, consideration and balance to the many others out there who need a shoulder.
I am therefore ending my point... by extending a 'humungous hug' and with love since we all need this as we battle to improve things in life....
As a positive thinker... 'together we can do it'... I feel very pleased to have you all in my life.
Please do something positive that makes you feel good about you today... if it's only a small stride...a hairwash... a bath... any little wellbeing treat...
Most importantly, respect the views of others, but continue on your journey, whichever way you can and good luck to each and every person facing this challenge.
My advice would be to you Jaffa... not to isolate yourself but to step back and now forward... we all including you, have something to offer others, which in turn helps yourself on this journey xxx
My background has been in the community mental health field for more years than I can count... I won't labour my experience... but after many years working in and out of psychiatric hospitals and the transfer of 'care in the community' post Virginia Bottomley... I have gained a lot of insight into the anguish of many and as such I am responding to this post.
It is a very 'closed' view to try and place individuals in their 'rightful boxes in society'... these boxes cannot and should not exist for the fundamental reason that we are individuals from every angle and we are not programmed like machinery to fit in like a 'cog in a wheel'.
Each individual's case history and story on their journey is unique to them and everyone's situation varies via physical, mental, or financial circumstances.
I cannot therefore see why anyone should be 'labelled or made to feel inadequate in any way'... this journey is hard enough for everyone involved and if someone 'chose' to opt for a private alternative... then that is what is right for them...
I have considered the private option... but have now discontinued that thought... it was part of my journey to explore it... but I am intent on learning, digesting and working through my issues in a 'balanced' way before my surgery.
It is my 'choice' to wait and to have the operation on the NHS, although it has been offered to me through the efforts of my diabetic consultant... I do not see myself as a burden to the NHS because I have worked all of my life, nor do I think anyone who has not been able to work should be made to feel guilty either...
The majority of us have 'comfort' ate, or call it what you like for reasons which are individual and I would like to say that no matter what... I would always hope to learn and share my experience to encourage others to start this difficult journey...
I do not believe in stigmatising individuals, who may already be feeling sensitive or lost and in fear of their future... that is not the way to go...
We have choices, about whether we throw open the hand of friendship and support... many of us don't have choices about whether we pay or don't pay...
Whichever way we all need support and all need consideration as individuals... what I would not want to see is any of my friends on here hurt or feeling put down in any way.
I would like to say that I am hoping to be around on this site for a long time in order to not only get myself through my journey, but to show care, consideration and balance to the many others out there who need a shoulder.
I am therefore ending my point... by extending a 'humungous hug' and with love since we all need this as we battle to improve things in life....
As a positive thinker... 'together we can do it'... I feel very pleased to have you all in my life.
Please do something positive that makes you feel good about you today... if it's only a small stride...a hairwash... a bath... any little wellbeing treat...
Most importantly, respect the views of others, but continue on your journey, whichever way you can and good luck to each and every person facing this challenge.
My advice would be to you Jaffa... not to isolate yourself but to step back and now forward... we all including you, have something to offer others, which in turn helps yourself on this journey xxx
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hear hear bev, tho jaffa it was only your opinion and view which were all entitled to so hope your feeling ok this morning! and kinda dust your shoulders off and crack on with the day..... nooooow, have i any nurotic moments you can help me with??.... hmmmm only joking babe! hope there s none today ha x
Private surgery isn't just rich people. Ordinary people can often manage it they really rethink their budgets. I borrowed, borrowed and borrowed to fund my ops. I also prioritised and went without things that many consider essentials. No Sky TV, cigarettes or pub. Funding the op is so hard but I also object to funding these in others via the benefits system.
As for cheating, I was really good in my first year but it is hard to resist temptation for ever. Just don't do it every day.
As for cheating, I was really good in my first year but it is hard to resist temptation for ever. Just don't do it every day.
jaffa_cake
New Member
Keeley86...... I didn't try and go down the NHS route I just rang my provider and booked it, I wouldn't have been big enough to get funding as far as I know you have to have a BMI of over 60 with co-morbidities etc so believe me there is no bitterness to those who have had it funded by the NHS!! Comments like that make me laugh because it seems to be peoples only argument to those of us who went private!
anyway.....
Thank you to everyone who commented whether you agreed with me or not it made interesting reading
and Kelly yes i'm fine this morning pet, how are you?
so believe me there is no bitterness to those who have had it funded by the NHS!! Comments like that make me laugh because it seems to be peoples only argument to those of us who went private! anyway.....
Thank you to everyone who commented whether you agreed with me or not it made interesting reading
and Kelly yes i'm fine this morning pet, how are you?
jaffa_cake
New Member
Great stuff thats what i did, I had loads bought before I had my op to fit in to, it was great, better paying half price for stuff than full price!!
Not doing anything today pet just a bit of spring cleaning...hateful but someone has to do it!!
Not doing anything today pet just a bit of spring cleaning...hateful but someone has to do it!!
slimmersal
sallie
i had severe asthma, high blood pressure and a family history of heart disease, diabetes and strokes.
After a lot of deliberation i paid to have a band fitted, it wasnt something i did lightly. i now hardly ever use my inhaler and have come off alot of my meds.
i spent the equivalant of a new car, would anyone have commented if thats what i spent my money on!! i bought back my health and i will never regret this decision.
we have all deserved our surgeries however we got them, i dont understand why there should be a difference between private and nhs, we all had an operation, we all had an anthestic, what is the difference between my scars, does my band look any different to anyone elses, the answer is no and im sure thats the same for bypass patients, we are all the same, we all appreciate our surgeries, some have had to wait for funding some of us have had to raise the funds ourselves. i think we should stop comparing each group its like a game of them and us.
i dont think its right to judge people as if loosing weight was that simple we would all be riding up the road on our bikes in nice size ten clothes.
im just enjoying my new found health and take my hat off to anyone who has undertaken the weightloss route as it isnt easy. i would also wish everyone who has taken this path good luck
sallie
After a lot of deliberation i paid to have a band fitted, it wasnt something i did lightly. i now hardly ever use my inhaler and have come off alot of my meds.
i spent the equivalant of a new car, would anyone have commented if thats what i spent my money on!! i bought back my health and i will never regret this decision.
we have all deserved our surgeries however we got them, i dont understand why there should be a difference between private and nhs, we all had an operation, we all had an anthestic, what is the difference between my scars, does my band look any different to anyone elses, the answer is no and im sure thats the same for bypass patients, we are all the same, we all appreciate our surgeries, some have had to wait for funding some of us have had to raise the funds ourselves. i think we should stop comparing each group its like a game of them and us.
i dont think its right to judge people as if loosing weight was that simple we would all be riding up the road on our bikes in nice size ten clothes.
im just enjoying my new found health and take my hat off to anyone who has undertaken the weightloss route as it isnt easy. i would also wish everyone who has taken this path good luck
sallie
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